TOPIC:

I'm in the mood to work on databases at the moment, and I would like suggestions to how to further develop the Model and/or Parts database .

What info are you missing?
What would be nice to know?

I've got a few improvement projects lined up, but I would like to hear from you on what you would like added or changed.

-Lars

PS: For direct data/image errors in the Database, please use the "Report error or missing info"-link on the bottom-right of each detail page.

Hi Lars,
Given the difficulty in removing paint, maybe a page dedicated to paint removal, as this seems to crop up fairly regularly. I don't know how this would work, I was thinking of listing information based on chemical/solvent and then sub divided on its effects on the different know plastics or model types. I'd be happy to help setup such a database,

regards

Johann

Hi Johann,
I understand the need for such a database, but I'm afraid that I, and most likely any other on this site, are sufficient qualified to work out a list that we could present as "safe".

In my mind, the chemical properties of both the clear plastics and the stuff we throw at just varies too much, and we don't know what makes it go wrong when it does.

I have several experiences with both Caustic Soda and Brake Fluid that contradicts each other so my basic advice is "be careful and test before you possibly destroy your shell.

In addition there are hundreds of different Brake Fluids available, and you have a vast variety of products containing Caustic Soda. There is just too many factors.

It's a bit more easy with hard plastics, but I have also had a couple of cases where the seemingly hard plastic (ABS?) has turned soft after a too long soak.

I think the best we can do is to post our experience in the Forums and try to be as specific as we can to the chemicals and plastics we played with.

-Lars

I think it's an excellent idea yogi, but agree with lars that it's such a minefield it ought to be a forum collection of member experiences rather than recommendations ...

I'm currently working on a spreadsheet of what I've done, my header row is:
material type, manufacturer, colour, car, age, part, paint, chemical, method, results, & link,

& an example of the data is:
Styrene, Tamiya, green, Wild Willy M38 LWB, c1983?, body parts, unknown aerosol, De-Solv-It Grafitti Remover (UK), multiple applications/scrubs/rinses, all paint removed + slight melting of surface, extensive clouding, www.tamiyabase....itstart=10

... it's mostly there, but the links will take some time to winkle out.

It was your idea, so if you want to post a thread (with suitable caveats) on the topic I'll gladly contribute. Let me know if you've got a preference how the data is ordered & sorted, it's a lot easier to do before posting.

Hi Lars,
you are indeed correct in that is is a mindfield with the different paints, plastics and chemicals that need to be dealt with, and such a list will never be entirely accurate or safe if used improperly. In knowing that (and as Jonny said), it would just be a collection of links and experiences, with any chemical(s) suggested in such a list would be bought and not made. I would also draw the line at mentioning or recommending the mixing of different chemicals. Still I'd like to press ahead with some sort of collection of peoples experiences (and associated warnings!). I also have a strong science background, so I am happy to do some research on the chemicals and plastics involved.

Jonny - thanks for the offer, I will take you up on it. I have been thinking about how to organise this as its rather complicated and could easily grow to be quite large.

This is my thinking process on how to organise and collect peoples experiences. There are 3 main factors to deal with;
1. the paint,
2. the plastic its been adhered too,
3. which chemical to try.

Quite often the paint used won't be known (or multiple types layered) and the plastic will be a general guess. The plastic is the centre piece, in that its the thing we are trying to save. The chemicals we get to choose though, so to me this means the collection should be based first on the different chemicals used, followed by observed effects on different plastics.

Now plastics have changed a lot in the last few decades and many bodies will have aged, which makes older plastic in some cases less resistant than newer plastics to some chemicals. Since its going to be almost impossible to accurately know the exact chemical makeup of some of the older plastics, categories might also have to be based on model, time and/or manufacturer, e.g. early Wild Willy body or early polystyrene plastic body.

Which brings us to the chemicals. There are general chemicals such as acetone and caustic soda of which the chemistry can be looked up easily and then there are branded names such as dettol. The important aspect is to try and understand the active ingredient where possible. This would be difficult for some chemicals like graffitti remover or brake fluid that might be propriety. What will also need to be known is if the chemical was diluted and what was the ambient temperate of the solution was.

The other thing is once there is a bit of info, I think it will be hard to go through and read easily on a forum format. I would prefer to set it up in some sort of database, which would allow cross referencing (I can do this and even host the database). But before all that, maybe we can start with a list of chemicals and links to posts about them.

I'm thinking the submitted format might be something like:
a. chemical,
b.concentration,
c.temperature,
d.plastic or body applied too,
e.length of time,
f.a suitability rating,
g.link to post

is that too much to begin with? and Lars are you bothered about non-Tamiyabase links?

The rating would be a subjective number between 1 and 10, 1 being disasterous, 5 being no effect and 10 being very worth the effort.

so I guess the first thing is if Lars is ok with me pressing ahead with it, if so I'll start and new thread. From there I hope to get feedback with any critiques or further suggestions?

regards

Johann

yogi-bear wrote:

...

I'm thinking the submitted format might be something like:
a. chemical,
b.concentration,
c.temperature,
d.plastic or body applied too,
e.length of time,
f.a suitability rating,
g.link to post

...

It's your baby so I'll hand over the information you ask for, in the format you want it, but I think your fields show your interest in researching the chemistry of it all, rather than the "I need to strip the paint off an x, what can I use?" questions that the casual reader is likely to be asking.

The "suitability rating" could be problematic; I use a lot of (UK) De-Solv-It grafitti remover, and because I'm prepared to do the rework on hard bodies (sanding, priming, filling, sanding, & priming again) to overcome its drawbacks (surface melting & clouding) I'd rate it a 9 on your scale, but for someone who wasn't, it could be a 3 (recoverable with extra work?). On the other hand, someone might rate brake fluid as a 10 as it doesn't need rework, but I'd rate as a 5 or 6 (no effect or very little effect) as it takes so long to take paint off.

yogi-bear wrote:

so I guess the first thing is if Lars is ok with me pressing ahead with it, if so I'll start and new thread. From there I hope to get feedback with any critiques or further suggestions?

No problem, Johann, go ahead!
-Lars

Hi Jonny,
I agree to keep it as simple as possible, but its going to be a balance between a simple howto and a bit of chemistry I think. I guess what I am trying to address is that I've read a few posts, which even though is the same chemical, seems to give a different result, hence my choice on some of those fields. For me outcomes will change because of variances in the concentration, temperature and length of time in contact.

As for the rating system, agreed its also a bit of slippery slope thing. Its a bit like a pain chart, it comes done personal views. Maybe can change it a little and have a dual rating, such as 1 to 10 for how effective paint is removed, and another 1 to 10 on how much work has to be done afterwards? I know its still not going to be perfect, but at least it might give anyone who looks at it some idea of what lies ahead.

I'll start a new post on this though and we can discuss the details a bit more,

regards

Johann

Lars

First a big thank you to providing such a fantastic database and forum


I would like to see a link within each 'model' section that takes you to the 'boxart' 'decal' and other sections, this would allow you to navigate by model as well as other items

Under paint :
Not sure if something like this is wanted or even possible, but have a look at this link
scalemodeldb.co...rts/tamiya
It allows you to match other paint systems with tamiya
Maybe just a link would suffice

I also came across this motor database, might give you a bit of extra information ?
www.zaonce.com/...tors.shtml
I was surprised at the 2 different types of sport tuned motors (1 asia and 1 europe)
apparently the holes on the pinion side are also in different positions ?

Terragni

If I could wish for ONE thing in the Tamiyabase database, it would be this:

An accurate list of every difference between the original cars and the re-releases - right down to the kit box differences.

Too many sites on the internet simply say "it's similar" or "it's the same", when clearly there are massive differences that many people care about. Even if we're just talking about decals - that's a massive difference.

In every regard, Tamiya fanatics are very fussy and precise about every aspect of modeling. So why is there still no website with a definitive list of changes? I think it's because most re-release owners are trying to turn a blind eye and "not worry about it too much", and just sort of paper-over the issue, and ignore it.

And yet, on eBay, even for a Grasshopper kit, an original kit will sometimes sell as high as $400, while a re-release is only worth about $130 or something. The reasons behind that need to be explained somewhere. The difference in price would probably be even greater is there was a place for people to really learn about changes to the models.

Anyway, it's a big task, but that's my suggestion! Tamiyabase is the perfect place for it, because this site is more analytical than most others.

tamiyabase.com/...Itemid=589

Need to greatly expand on "it's a realistic reissue".

H.